10 Replies Latest reply on Aug 30, 2013 7:08 AM by volain

    how to copy block to schematic

    volain

      I have a block in a project.  There are no values assigned to components in the block; the values are assigned in the instances in the top level schematic.  In other words, if I look at the block, there's a resistor, R? with no value, but if I click on the block in my schematic and Push Schematic, I can see that it's R1 and 10K.  Now, I want to be able to copy that instance to another schematic page (in another project).  If I just copy the block, it won't bring along the values, but I don't see any way of copying the instance with assigned values, although it looks just like any other schematic page when I push into it.

       

      Is this possible?  Also, is there a way to turn a block into a schematic page?

       

      Thanks,

       

      Barry

        • 1. Re: how to copy block to schematic
          Gary_Lameris

          Let's start from the last question.  A schematic block is a set of schematic pages at the same level in the design.  A schematic block may be a single page.  To copy a single page block instead of the whole block change the settings of the Navigator: Setup, Settings, Navigator, Sheets, Display sheets, Always.  (The default is "Only if there is more than one")

           

          Now to copy a page with reference designators and values.  Open the design with the values and reference desinators shown.  Go to Setup, Settings, Advanced and enable Preserve packaging info on copy.  Press OK.  In the Navigator, select the sheet from the block that needs to be copied. RMB Copy

           

          Open the project to paste the circuit, create a new page in the design, and RMB paste on the new page in the navigator.  A warning will occur that you are about to overwrite the contents of the page, confirm if you are overwriting the new page.  The paste operation should include the values and the reference designators.

          • 2. Re: how to copy block to schematic
            volain

            Hi Gary,

             

            1) I don't have "Preserve packagin info on copy" as a selection under Settings/Advanced.  I'm using PADS 9.2, Update 2

            2) The schematic in question is not an explicit sheet-this is a hierarchical design.  Under the Project heading, I have Boards and I have a Block (FrontEnd). Under Boards I have a Schematic, TPM4. In the schematic, TPM4, I instantiate two symbols which are two instances of the block "FrontEnd" named "Channel1" and "Channel2". Thus, there are no "sheets" for Channel1 and Channel2; the only way I can see their components is to select the symbol and RMB/Push Schematic.  I can, however, see in "Symbols" under TPM4/Sheet1 symbols for Channel1 and Channel2 which are yellow icons like the top level schematic. 

             

            In other words, here's what my structure looks like (hope this displays correctly):

            TPM4 (project)

                 Boards

                      TPM4(board-green icon)

                           TPM4_4(schematic-yellow icon)

                                Sheet1

                                     Symbols

                                          .

                                          .

                                          Channel1(FrontEnd.1 yellow icon)

                                               Symbols

                                               Nets

                                          Channel2(FrontEnd.1 yellow icon)

                                     Nets

                                Sheet2

                 Blocks

                      FrontEnd(schematic-yellow icon)

            • 3. Re: how to copy block to schematic
              Gary_Lameris

              I think that's a great reason to upgrade to the significant new usability enhancements added into the current release.

               

              Of course there are sheets for channel 1 and 2.  If you push into your channels there is schematic sheet.  In the attached photo on the right top is channel 1 and on the right bottom is channel 2.  These have the Reference Designators assigned as R1 and R4.  The block level view is shown on the lower left with R?

               

              hierarchy 2.jpg

              You could try running DxDatabook on the block (lower part of the navigator) to update the Value at the block level.  Otherwise, you can manually assign the value there for copying into your new design.

              • 4. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                volain

                Ok, so how do I copy those sheets?  They may be "sheets" in the sense that they look the same as any other schematic sheet on the screen, but the fact that they are down in the hierarchy seems to make them unaccessable for copying.

                 

                On the top level schematic I can RMB and select copy, but on the schematic under Symbols, that option doesn't exist.  I know how to copy a Block.  I still don't know how to copy that sheet Channel1, I don't want to go back to the block and add values to 100 components, especially since they already exist.

                • 5. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                  Gary_Lameris

                  There are at least 4 methods.

                   

                  1.  Read my first response

                  2.  Contact support to walk you through the issue

                  3.  open the block and press page down to create a second page, then page 1 will show in the navigator

                  4.  open the block and copy the circuitry with unique name on copy set to off.

                   

                  Upgrade to the latest release to take advantage of the usability enhancements in DxDesigner.

                  • 6. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                    volain

                    Hi Gary,

                     

                    1) Sorry, but your first response apparently doesn't apply to PADS 9.2, as neither of those suggested modifications exist under Settings.

                    2) I am no longer on support

                    3 &4) I guess I didn't really explain my problem well enough. 

                     

                    a) The block does not have values assigned to the components, only the instances that appear in the Symbols category under my top level schematic do. THAT'S what I want to copy, since it has values assigned to components.

                     

                    Here's the project.  Under Blocks, FrontEnd is the schematic that is instantiated  as symbol "Channel_1_2" in the top schematic.  The lower left schematic shows what you see if you Push Schematic in that symbol (note values assigned to components).  The lower right schematic is FrontEnd under Blocks (notice no values).  I've also shown the expanded Navigator showing where Channel_1_2 is located under Symbols.  (I hope this is visible).

                    dx12.jpg

                    • 7. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                      Gary_Lameris

                      No problem in PADS 9.2

                      navigator blocks.PNG

                      Pasted into a new project from the above project even contains the instance values of refdes

                      pasted block.PNG

                      I don't understand what your issue is.

                      • 8. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                        volain

                        Ok.  Apparently the problem is that "Display Sheets/Always" needs to be set. My block is a single sheet schematic, so when I clicked on the schematic instance under Symbol (the yellow icon) all it showed below the icon was a Symbols folder and a Nets folder-no sheet.  Right clicking on the schematic doesn't work. This is pretty arcane.  

                         

                        So, this all begs the questions:

                         

                        1) Why should you have to tell the software to display a sheet? Wouldn't you ALWAYS want the sheet displayed, since it won't let you copy a single sheet schematic otherwise?  How would a user even know this, it sure isn't discussed in the documenation?  This looks like another case of software designed by programmers for programmers, not for users.

                         

                        2) Shouldn't you be able to copy a multiple-sheet schematic by clicking the Schematic icon rather than having to copy each sheet? This would be particularly true for a hierarchical block.

                         

                        Sorry if I'm flaming a bit, but this just shouldn't be that hard. DxDesigner does what it does well, but some of the most fundamental tasks are just absurdly complex.

                        • 9. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                          robert_davies

                          One question and two answers:

                           

                          Question: The statement "Right clicking on the schematic doesn't work" What are you expecting with a right click, 'open' like in Design Capture? In DxD left clicking will open the schematic from the schematic node.

                           

                          Answer 1: Default is to always show sheets but some users might want to see just the hierarchy. Our intention is to make turning these options on and off much easier in the Navigator rather than having nto go back to the settings dialog.

                           

                          Answer 2: You can do this from the blocks node but this doesn't have design context and so doesn't have the information you required of the Reference Designators. The blocks node shows the blocks used in the design but not where they are used. From the Boards node you have design context and so the correct reference designators but as each sheet is separate inside the database it is more difficult to copy all sheets from the block node. To achieve what you require necessitates selecting the sheet in the design context and copying that to your other project.

                          • 10. Re: how to copy block to schematic
                            volain

                            As far as what I was expecting: When you RMB a sheet, the COPY option is available; this is also true for the top-level schematic; however, this is not the case for the schematic of the hierarchical block.(By that I mean the schematic that appears under the Symbol folder)

                             

                            Displaying sheets is apparently NOT the default mode, because up until two hours ago, I didn't even know this option existed. 

                             

                            I don't understand why individual sheets of a schematic are considered separate entities when they are inside the Board, but not when they are inside a block.  The concept of a "sheet" within a schematic is purely a graphical construct and not a physical one.  Ten sheets of a schematic could just as well be a single sheet, as far as how components are connected together, etc. are concerned.  Ah, well, just a software issue, I guess.

                             

                            At least now I can copy individual sheets, which is not such a hardship.  Basically, problem solved.